Hi again,
When using pgn4web default board is always viewed from white player. It would be great if it was possible to turn board.
Turn board is primarily a feature for the user, who creates the pgn. The chosen "turn board" setting should apply on every load.
Subsequently anonymous users frontend can chance the turn board setting as they wish, but if they reload the page it will go back to the chosen turn board setting again.
This feature will give users the opportunity to select black as main focus in a game. This would be great – especially in games where black plays extraordinary good or e.g. when our chess club members played against another chess club. In these games we usually want to see our own members view.
Comments
Comment #1
casaschi commentedThis is not supported by the underlying pgn4web library and can not be implemented (easily) by the drupal module without changes to the underlying library.
The feature is not planned for inclusion into the library, the author believes chess diagrams should be shown with white on bottom: what if you only have a few pieces and pawns on the initial board? Why confusing the user presenting some boards turned over?
Once loaded the user can look at the position from the black viewpoint by using the "f" shortcut key or the "e7" shortcut square.
Comment #2
Bjoern Olsen commentedHi Casaschi,
Thanks for your reply. It may be too difficult to implement, but our chess club members would certainly consider it a great feature.
When we discuss black moves – and take black’s starting point as subject for discussion (e.g. about chess openings), we would turn board and look at it from black’s point of view.
When we make a chess-puzzle with the question: “Black moves and wins. Can you find the move?” then we would certainly also want black’s point of view.
I understand your objection, but in these cases it would be even more confusing with white on bottom.
I think maybe we can add a detail to this request that would be with advantage for both wishes:
- In left side of chess board next to line 1 and 8 a small black/white blip indicates that white is on bottom and black on top – and the other way round with black on bottom and white on top, if that’s selected.
Comment #3
casaschi commentedI appreciate the suggestion, but this was already considered for the pgn4web library a long time ago; even if the change to the library would be rather simple, the feature was finally discarded in order to keep the display simple and easy to understand.
If all the diagram are displayed with white on bottom (as more than 99% of the diagrams in chess books, magazines and websites), then there's no confusion whatsoever. Adding clutter to the display (such as the side to move flag, or coordinates) is something I stayed deliberately away from.
If you really need to flip some chessboards, I'd suggest looking to other tools that might offer what you are looking for; for example the chessflash tool (see http://chessflash.com/chessflash.html not sure of any drupal integration but anything that lets you add iframes to your pages would work).
Comment #4
Bjoern Olsen commentedI understand that “turn board” never will be a part of this project, but I have to say I think it’s a shame. Maybe we use chessboards in different ways, - but why prevent all users from this option? The users are grown up people how can decide for themselves if they want to use this kind of option or not. Users can easily ignore it if they wish.
Just to show you that this is not one man’s stupid idea – try and see the Danish Chess Unions (national organization of chess players in DK) database of chess games: http://www.dsu.dk/MODULER/danbase/index.php Here you’ll see the turn board-bottom in the lower right corner.
Try and have a look at the chess videos on The English Chess Federation’s site: http://www.englishchess.org.uk/ Here you’ll also see black on bottom in certain games.
And if you do tactics on web, you’ll see that the color on bottom quite often depends on who’s is going to move: e.g. http://www.chess.com/tactics/ and http://chesstempo.com
This is just a few examples. Did these sites got it all wrong? Is it confusing? No, it’s just user friendly :-)
Anyway… Thank you for your suggestion – and I really mean that. I’m not good at coding, but I’ll try and see, what I can find out.
Comment #5
casaschi commentedI probably haven't explained myself clearly enough, I'll try again:
I believe that if I were to add the "flip board at startup" option then I would have to add to the chessboard display some form of indication of the board orientation. In other words, in order to meet the needs of some users for less than 1% of the chessboards I would have to make ALL chessboards look worse (in my opinion).
It's the feature you asked for versus keeping a minimalistic display. My personal and (I agree) questionable choice is for the latter (more or less the same minimalistic thinking that resulted in the non-availability of another common user request: coordinates letter/numbers around the chessboard).
If you can suggest a non-intrusive way to show when a chessboard is flipped, without adding any additional user interface element to the current display and respecting the current minimalistic approach of pgn4web, I *might* consider it, again subject to my very personal opinion and taste.
Final note on your comments: I don't feel I "prevent all users from this option", in fact I dont prevent anything from anyone. If anything I enable web developers and site administrators to show the pgn4web chessboards, for free without strings attached. As grownup people, these users can look at my tool and if they like they use it. If they don't like it, either they can use something else (there's plenty of options) or they can modify the code to their liking. With all those options available, I really don't see how not implementing the feature some people want becomes "preventing all users from this option".
Comment #6
Bjoern Olsen commented@casaschi – it’s okay. We don’t have to agree on this subject. I appreciate all the work that’s done in here to improve drupal – including yours. I’ll jump out of this discussion to concentrate on development of my site.
Best wishes…
Comment #7
Robrecht Jacques commentedI'll set this as "postponed" (although "won't fix" is probably a better choice).
The module only aims to easy the use of pgn4web into a Drupal site. I had and have no intentions to change the underlying library.
There are some benefits in "Drupalizing" the board.html... e.g. make it a themeable function, maybe even invoking the functionality without the
, etc - maybe even in cooperation with chessboard renderer etc. This however would involve a lot of work though, as board.html and the javascript are interwoven quite a bit. So: options not provided by board.html / pgn4web.js by its author (casaschi) will not find their way in the module. (it might be possible to "flip the board" using the jquery of the module (calling the right function after load). But you'll still need some way to visually show the upside-down board)Comment #8
Martin Pluta commentedIf you would like to permanently change the board orientation, you may achieve this by inserting the FlipBoard() function call into the function Init(nextGame) of the pgn4web.js file, following the OpenGame(currentGame) function call.
This does only work out, if the Init(nextGame) function is called once, of course, since calling it twice will result in another flip, setting it back to the original orientation.
Comment #9
avpaderno