First, the screenshot: (250K) Views Form Builder

This post is twofold. First, to show off. Views is very close to being finished and I'm looking to get some people using it to help me find the vast array of bugs I'm sure are still lurking in the system. The second is that I'd like to get a little feedback on the UI design. It's...very large. But I think it works. And it's been impossibly to really describe Views in just a sentence or two. This screenshot says more about what the system can do than I can get across just by describing it.

This UI is used only by site admin/designer types, and not by the general user. It will see larger use early in the design stage of a site and much less as changes amount only to tweaking or adding of new features. I'm curious as to whether or not any of the UI gurus think there are things that are actively wrong or could be improved.

One suggestion that I dislike is to break it up into multiple pages. I like the idea that I can manipulate by adding and subtracting fields without saving it; as soon as it goes to a multiple page layout, I'm likely stuck. Also, it adds a lot of clicks...and there are already a lot of clicks. I will consider arguments to the contrary but be aware that I'm not really for the idea of a multi-page setup without some really good reasoning behind it.

Comments

scroogie’s picture

Wow, now thats what I call a form. ;)
Still very much like the idea, so I hope I will have have enough time to test it this weekend.

Regards
Andre

Mad Maks’s picture

i am using you module allready and i find it very usefull. if i find somithing i will post it here.

kbahey’s picture

Hey Merlin

Good work. I played with an earlier version, and I like it.

The admin UI could use a lot of collapsible stuff in the new Form API in 4.7. This would reduce the clutter.
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dkruglyak’s picture

Let's not abandon 4.6 just yet. Those of us who are using many contrib modules in production would not be able to upgrade for a while.

I suggest if you want to use any 4.7 features to also create a 4.6 branch.

merlinofchaos’s picture

There is a 4.6 branch, and it works.

However, I don't intend to backport some of the newer features to the 4.6 version. The work required to do that is mighty and I'm already putting in a LOT of time on this project.

I understand that upgrading is going to be hard. I have to deal with 3 sites myself, and I do want to upgrade them all once there's a stable 4.7. I might even upgrade one to beta2 just to see.

The good news is that some of the new features can obsolete a number of the older contrib modules. And many of the contrib maintainers are in the process of updating. So it's not impossible that within a month or two most of the contrib modules you need will be updated. And if you can't find the maintainer, it might be possible to get someone else to work on updating for someone.

-- Merlin

[Point the finger: Assign Blame!]
[Read my writing: ehalseymiles.com]

-- Merlin

[Read my writing: ehalseymiles.com]
[Read my Coding blog: Angry Donuts]

merlinofchaos’s picture

Perhaps. I am not actually a big fan of the collapsible fieldsets in 4.7; unless a section sees limited use (the input formats, for example; except that's not necessarily even true) then I prefer not to collapse it. It adds extra clicks and on a large form, makes it really hard to find things.

-- Merlin

[Point the finger: Assign Blame!]
[Read my writing: ehalseymiles.com]

-- Merlin

[Read my writing: ehalseymiles.com]
[Read my Coding blog: Angry Donuts]

bonobo’s picture

I think there's something to be said for them -- or at least for providing the option of collapsing them, and having the default be that the fieldsets open fully expanded.

Giving the user the choice to reduce the visual clutter on the page can often pay off in increased usability.

Just my .02

Cheers,

Bill

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Tools for Teachers

Steve Dondley’s picture

I have the same reservations about collapsible fields. But not everything is black and white. It definitely works for your module.

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ixis.dylan’s picture

The forms in this module scare the hell out of me, but this (along with the mystical CCK) could replace half of the modules in core.

Perhaps you could provide a few more example views with this module to help people set up custom ones? Maybe a view to show blog posts (to replace /blog), or an alternative forum interface (to replace /forum/*).

Breaking up the form into multiple pages would be nasty, IMO. Complicated features require complicated forms, and there isn't much you can do about that. More examples and better inline help would simplify the user experience without simplifying the form.

demolicious | leafish

robertDouglass’s picture

CCK is going to be developed very intensely in 2006. I'm already certain that there is room for convergence or sharing between CCK and Views.

- Robert Douglass

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My Drupal book: Building Online Communities with Drupal, phpBB and WordPress

merlinofchaos’s picture

CCK is on my todo list. I'm hopeful that the API as it is now is advanced enough to support CCK's needs; I suspect there will be some shortcomings that I will have to fix for it. It'll be a good place to really see the system.

Not quite there yet, though. Been slackin' (at least on Views) this week =)

-- Merlin

[Point the finger: Assign Blame!]
[Read my writing: ehalseymiles.com]

-- Merlin

[Read my writing: ehalseymiles.com]
[Read my Coding blog: Angry Donuts]

kbahey’s picture

Hi Earl

We discussed this briefly by email, allow me to elaborate here.

If CCK can expose the data fields and types for each different node type, then Views can provide the ability to sort and group on these fields.

This will be a very powerful feature to have.

The possibilities of your Views and CCK will be endless. Flexinode will be replaced, and there will be no need for many add on modules (e.g. tracker).

Thanks!

The future is promising ...
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Personal: Baheyeldin.com

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Personal blog: Ba

merlinofchaos’s picture

As I progress, I indeed will have multiple example views.

I also intend to set up an area in the handbook where people can trade views using the import/export feature that went in recently. That should take some of the work off my shoulders.

-- Merlin

[Point the finger: Assign Blame!]
[Read my writing: ehalseymiles.com]

-- Merlin

[Read my writing: ehalseymiles.com]
[Read my Coding blog: Angry Donuts]

bonobo’s picture

and so far, no big issues have arisen. Admittedly, I'm still sorting out the config options, and I want to be sure that anything I report is real, and not PEBKAC :)

First, great work on this. Between the views module, the category module, and CCK, many other contrib modules will be made unnecessary/obsolete -- I should probably add that to the "Predictions for 2006" thread.

Two suggestions for the admin interface:
1. Make the sections collapsible, like the general site settings you see in admin -> settings -- this would simplify the look of the form by allowing the user to focus on the specific section they want to see -- this also has the added advantage of breaking the sections down (roughly) by function: ie, one section for "display", one for "block", one for "url and pager", etc.

2. Similar to 1, but use tabs instead of collapsible sections. This would look like the admin interface for the htmlarea module in 4.6 -- this would not be a multi-page setup, but it would add extra clicks into the mix, and to some users it would feel like a multi-page setup.

With that said, I think option 1 would be a better fit with the existing admin look/feel of 4.7.

Again, thanks for your work on this.

Cheers,

Bill

-------
http://www.funnymonkey.com
Tools for Teachers

Emiliano’s picture

merlinofchaos,

I just wanted to say I tried views.module today and got very happy! It's really useful!

Congrats and thanks! Great job! Great module!

Emiliano.
http://www.novayork.com

ixis.dylan’s picture

A List Apart have a short article about sensible forms that might provide some inspiration?

demolicious | leafish