WEBVTT 127 00:11:31.740 --> 00:11:36.730 benji: welcome. This is the drupal usability meeting for July 26, th 2024. 128 00:11:37.100 --> 00:11:40.190 benji: I'm Benji Fisher, sharing my screen and moderating. 129 00:11:40.710 --> 00:11:44.239 benji: And also here are Erin Mchale, author, Shah 130 00:11:44.360 --> 00:11:46.910 benji: Ralph Kohler and Randy Yost. 131 00:11:48.970 --> 00:11:56.009 benji: Last week we were talking about this issue. It is number 3, 4, 5, 7, 9, 1, 4. 132 00:11:57.194 --> 00:12:01.910 benji: Certain users understand the word draft to mean unpublished. 133 00:12:02.080 --> 00:12:05.400 benji: and are surprised that a note in draft is published. 134 00:12:05.550 --> 00:12:08.820 benji: If a previous version of the node is published. 135 00:12:12.900 --> 00:12:14.190 benji: go 136 00:12:14.670 --> 00:12:15.690 benji: think 137 00:12:16.640 --> 00:12:20.840 benji: Ralph has prepared a site. With 138 00:12:21.610 --> 00:12:23.279 benji: current patch applied 139 00:12:28.420 --> 00:12:32.090 benji: usual super secure login of admin and admin 140 00:12:36.230 --> 00:12:38.279 benji: and if we 141 00:12:42.280 --> 00:12:44.149 benji: create, say, an article. 142 00:12:55.830 --> 00:12:57.000 benji: and I think 143 00:13:04.670 --> 00:13:05.709 benji: think we have the. 144 00:13:05.710 --> 00:13:06.150 Ralf Koller: Bench. 145 00:13:06.150 --> 00:13:07.670 benji: Moderation. Yes. 146 00:13:07.670 --> 00:13:18.889 Ralf Koller: Just 1 1 note before you proceed. Could you scroll up, please, cause there's 1 detail I wanted to highlight here as well, I've noticed 147 00:13:19.370 --> 00:13:25.859 Ralf Koller: in the advanced column on the sidebar, you have basically the last saved and author on top. 148 00:13:26.300 --> 00:13:28.870 Ralf Koller: But technically, it's 149 00:13:29.080 --> 00:13:45.249 Ralf Koller: hiding the current state, because, for example, for last, save, it's not safe yet. So it's still shown and already shown, basically, while the other, the moderation state which will be shown afterwards isn't shown there. 150 00:13:45.640 --> 00:13:50.719 Ralf Koller: because after that, in our test, then we will have, for example, draft there 151 00:13:51.630 --> 00:13:54.039 Ralf Koller: without a label also. So. 152 00:13:57.300 --> 00:13:58.160 benji: Okay. 153 00:13:58.570 --> 00:13:59.770 benji: just in respect. 154 00:14:00.640 --> 00:14:06.639 benji: Okay? And let's see. Shall I save? Say, this was the initial draft is published right? The initial 155 00:14:07.020 --> 00:14:08.800 benji: revision as published. 156 00:14:14.340 --> 00:14:15.959 benji: so here I have 157 00:14:16.190 --> 00:14:17.859 benji: simple test article. 158 00:14:18.765 --> 00:14:20.720 benji: I now go to edit it. 159 00:14:22.440 --> 00:14:23.970 benji: And 160 00:14:24.945 --> 00:14:27.950 benji: yeah, depending on my permissions, I might not 161 00:14:28.240 --> 00:14:31.949 benji: permission to create a new published division. 162 00:14:32.871 --> 00:14:39.529 benji: Since I do have all permissions I can choose, and I'm choosing to make it a draft 163 00:14:42.480 --> 00:14:44.020 benji: up here at the top. 164 00:14:45.500 --> 00:14:50.159 benji: we have, as Ralph points out, there's no label, but it says that it is published. 165 00:14:52.985 --> 00:14:58.129 benji: Has a timestamp for the last, save the author's admin, which is me. 166 00:15:02.230 --> 00:15:04.109 benji: so this will be in 167 00:15:04.460 --> 00:15:06.770 benji: a a draft 168 00:15:08.820 --> 00:15:10.280 benji: unpublished 169 00:15:12.330 --> 00:15:14.319 benji: division, and that's the 170 00:15:14.440 --> 00:15:17.899 benji: ambiguity we're trying to clear up. What what does it mean 171 00:15:19.140 --> 00:15:20.400 benji: to have 172 00:15:23.110 --> 00:15:25.460 benji: a draft revision? I can save this. 173 00:15:25.900 --> 00:15:29.269 benji: It'll create a second revision. So maybe I'll just go ahead and do that. 174 00:15:31.657 --> 00:15:36.540 benji: If you have permission to see the revisions, you can now see that there are 2 revisions. 175 00:15:37.326 --> 00:15:39.710 benji: One is the current 176 00:15:40.360 --> 00:15:42.729 benji: or or public revision. 177 00:15:45.690 --> 00:15:48.099 benji: and the second is a 178 00:15:48.940 --> 00:15:51.870 benji: a draft. So they're listed most recent. First, st 179 00:15:53.820 --> 00:15:59.309 benji: I have options to delete that revision or to set it as the current revision. 180 00:16:01.490 --> 00:16:02.740 benji: and the 181 00:16:03.090 --> 00:16:04.680 benji: the issue is that 182 00:16:04.810 --> 00:16:06.700 benji: on the edit page 183 00:16:07.470 --> 00:16:10.659 benji: those options, the status of the published draft 184 00:16:10.680 --> 00:16:16.779 benji: of the published revision and the draft revision is not made clear to the editor. 185 00:16:20.170 --> 00:16:22.629 benji: Ralph, is your hand still raised? Or again raised. 186 00:16:22.630 --> 00:16:24.060 Ralf Koller: It's again raised. 187 00:16:24.060 --> 00:16:24.650 benji: Okay, go ahead. 188 00:16:24.945 --> 00:16:27.310 Ralf Koller: Cause. There's another aspect. If you could go 189 00:16:27.540 --> 00:16:28.699 Ralf Koller: to the edit 190 00:16:29.030 --> 00:16:31.500 Ralf Koller: page again. Video again, please. 191 00:16:35.340 --> 00:16:45.029 Ralf Koller: Now with draft, it's again clear. But if there's also because before you had published, and that there's another aspect. Because if you could go now, maybe in another tab 192 00:16:45.230 --> 00:16:47.519 Ralf Koller: to the content page, please. 193 00:16:49.790 --> 00:16:51.980 Ralf Koller: To the content list overview. Yeah. 194 00:16:51.980 --> 00:16:52.486 benji: This one. 195 00:16:52.740 --> 00:16:53.970 Ralf Koller: Yep, yep, yep, yep. 196 00:16:56.010 --> 00:17:03.660 Ralf Koller: because, as you can see, I've added the moderation state, and there are 2 more issues that wakus on the 197 00:17:04.079 --> 00:17:05.850 Ralf Koller: on the Node edit form 198 00:17:06.260 --> 00:17:16.989 Ralf Koller: published. It's also not clear if it's basically the status which is published or not published, or it's if it's the moderation state. And that way it's also ambiguous. 199 00:17:17.030 --> 00:17:18.710 Ralf Koller: And the other detail. 200 00:17:19.190 --> 00:17:24.459 Ralf Koller: which is confusing, and I think goes into this issue as well and wasn't 201 00:17:24.930 --> 00:17:28.560 Ralf Koller: mentions there. If you add that moderation state. As you can see. 202 00:17:28.710 --> 00:17:30.390 Ralf Koller: we have status published. 203 00:17:30.400 --> 00:17:38.769 Ralf Koller: State is published, and Moderation State published, if you can. If you go now to the moderated content tab the secondary. 204 00:17:40.155 --> 00:17:40.790 benji: Yes. 205 00:17:40.790 --> 00:17:41.360 Ralf Koller: Yep. 206 00:17:44.010 --> 00:17:47.219 Ralf Koller: There you see, moderation state draft. So it's 207 00:17:48.020 --> 00:17:49.980 Ralf Koller: on our view. It's published 208 00:17:50.040 --> 00:17:52.789 Ralf Koller: on the moderated content. It's draft. 209 00:17:53.970 --> 00:17:55.740 Ralf Koller: So it's also inconsistent. 210 00:17:56.430 --> 00:18:02.990 benji: Right, I think, behind the scenes. The difference between these 2 tabs is that moderated content is 211 00:18:03.350 --> 00:18:06.460 benji: a view of note revisions, and it 212 00:18:07.140 --> 00:18:09.540 benji: shows the most recent revision 213 00:18:09.890 --> 00:18:12.320 benji: and overview is a 214 00:18:12.900 --> 00:18:14.940 benji: view of 215 00:18:15.190 --> 00:18:17.770 benji: nodes rather than no provisions. 216 00:18:18.720 --> 00:18:22.889 benji: I think that's at the heart of the difference between 217 00:18:24.240 --> 00:18:25.610 benji: what a chance here. 218 00:18:25.860 --> 00:18:35.630 Ralf Koller: But the fields. Edit on the view. I've used also revisions for the overview page, the same as the moderated content. 219 00:18:37.560 --> 00:18:40.410 benji: Right, this will go to Node. Slash 2 slash edit. 220 00:18:42.170 --> 00:18:45.569 benji: and this link will also go to Node Slash to slash edit. 221 00:18:54.590 --> 00:18:56.110 benji: Okay, so 222 00:18:56.260 --> 00:18:58.110 benji: so let's, you know. 223 00:18:58.630 --> 00:19:02.270 benji: for purposes of scope. Let's focus on the edit page 224 00:19:03.100 --> 00:19:04.420 benji: and 225 00:19:05.730 --> 00:19:06.860 benji: the 226 00:19:08.490 --> 00:19:12.439 benji: usual usability questions are. 227 00:19:13.054 --> 00:19:14.479 benji: how can we 228 00:19:14.590 --> 00:19:16.539 benji: describe the current state? 229 00:19:16.830 --> 00:19:22.589 benji: And how can we describe what options user has, or what the future state will be? 230 00:19:27.900 --> 00:19:29.180 benji: Now. 231 00:19:30.610 --> 00:19:32.830 benji: with the patch applied? 232 00:19:35.410 --> 00:19:38.169 benji: actually, I don't see the message from the cur. 233 00:19:38.590 --> 00:19:39.370 benji: Oh. 234 00:19:40.030 --> 00:19:41.859 Ralf Koller: One second I have to change the 235 00:19:44.480 --> 00:19:46.060 Ralf Koller: I think I'm 236 00:19:46.910 --> 00:19:48.029 Ralf Koller: on the wrong 237 00:19:48.340 --> 00:19:49.100 Ralf Koller: branch. 238 00:19:49.970 --> 00:19:52.476 benji: And actually, while while we're working on that 239 00:19:53.400 --> 00:19:57.860 benji: does anyone have any questions about the problem, we're trying to solve the 240 00:19:58.480 --> 00:20:00.820 benji: possible confusion here. 241 00:20:02.060 --> 00:20:06.220 benji: as the the issue title said, it's it's a question of 242 00:20:07.210 --> 00:20:09.659 benji: confusion between the State. 243 00:20:10.682 --> 00:20:12.429 benji: The moderation state 244 00:20:12.560 --> 00:20:13.590 benji: draft. 245 00:20:14.020 --> 00:20:18.889 benji: and whether the note is published or not, and and this idea that a node can be 246 00:20:19.110 --> 00:20:21.859 benji: both published and have a draft revision. 247 00:20:26.815 --> 00:20:28.440 Ralf Koller: You can reload now, Benji. 248 00:20:28.590 --> 00:20:29.290 benji: Okay. 249 00:20:36.040 --> 00:20:37.449 benji: So the 250 00:20:37.730 --> 00:20:42.260 benji: solution proposed in the issue is to add this line here. 251 00:20:44.010 --> 00:20:48.390 benji: Previous revision of this note is published. See all revisions. 252 00:20:50.230 --> 00:20:51.670 benji: and 253 00:20:52.570 --> 00:20:53.630 benji: well, Pat 254 00:20:54.040 --> 00:20:56.670 benji: can be helpful. The 255 00:20:57.130 --> 00:21:01.239 benji: we we got to the point last week, where we agreed that instead of 256 00:21:01.350 --> 00:21:03.190 benji: adding it here 257 00:21:04.135 --> 00:21:07.959 benji: we should be adding some more information up here. 258 00:21:08.200 --> 00:21:12.920 benji: because this is the natural place to give the current status. 259 00:21:14.802 --> 00:21:18.339 benji: We didn't get as far as deciding exactly 260 00:21:18.440 --> 00:21:21.340 benji: what information should be added here. 261 00:21:23.530 --> 00:21:25.629 benji: But, as Ralph points out, this 262 00:21:25.790 --> 00:21:28.940 benji: draft doesn't have any label, so 263 00:21:29.732 --> 00:21:31.909 benji: so adding a label might help. 264 00:21:32.420 --> 00:21:36.530 benji: and also adding the information, not just 265 00:21:36.650 --> 00:21:37.480 benji: about 266 00:21:37.850 --> 00:21:41.709 benji: the the latest revision which is draft, but also the fact 267 00:21:41.790 --> 00:21:43.200 benji: that there is 268 00:21:43.670 --> 00:21:46.289 benji: previous revision that is published. 269 00:21:47.400 --> 00:21:50.510 benji: So somehow we should add that information there. 270 00:21:50.800 --> 00:21:52.733 benji: and secondarily, 271 00:21:55.320 --> 00:21:59.550 benji: perhaps we should add some information we already have. 272 00:22:00.980 --> 00:22:06.560 benji: these 2 lines, current state is draft and change to draft. 273 00:22:10.600 --> 00:22:11.680 benji: Perhaps 274 00:22:11.780 --> 00:22:14.760 benji: there should be some clarification there 275 00:22:14.940 --> 00:22:18.410 benji: as to what the effect is of those choices. 276 00:22:18.900 --> 00:22:22.690 benji: Does that about sum up where where we ended up at the end of last week's meeting. 277 00:22:26.270 --> 00:22:29.319 benji: I think, Ralph Aaron, and offer world here. 278 00:22:29.620 --> 00:22:31.390 benji: I'm getting a thumbs up from Ralph. 279 00:22:32.400 --> 00:22:48.079 Aaron McHale: Yeah, I I think that's I think that's about it. I know we talked about a lot of detail, and last week feels like about a year ago and based on my current workload. So I'm trying to remember. But i i i think that kind of summarizes where we got to. Yeah. 280 00:22:49.120 --> 00:22:53.520 Aaron McHale: we did also actually talk about not having the link, because 281 00:22:53.891 --> 00:23:01.518 Aaron McHale: we already have. You know, when you're when you're up at that point, you already are so close to the revisions, tab and 282 00:23:02.070 --> 00:23:07.559 Aaron McHale: you know we, I suppose? I suppose I could think of other reasons not to have a link, but. 283 00:23:11.120 --> 00:23:16.809 benji: That's right. So if we add some information up here, we're very close to 284 00:23:17.450 --> 00:23:19.490 benji: the tabs or the 285 00:23:20.780 --> 00:23:22.280 benji: local actions. 286 00:23:22.580 --> 00:23:23.610 benji: So 287 00:23:26.660 --> 00:23:30.069 benji: so, as Aaron says, we probably don't need the additional link. 288 00:23:31.960 --> 00:23:36.029 benji: So so let's focus on this area 1st and 289 00:23:38.410 --> 00:23:40.840 benji: how do we want to be more clear 290 00:23:41.120 --> 00:23:42.620 benji: about the 291 00:23:43.810 --> 00:23:46.780 benji: status of the revisions. 292 00:23:56.650 --> 00:24:06.340 Aaron McHale: Okay, I would agree with what think it was? Maybe, Ralph said. Or you, said Benji, about having a label for draft, because draft and so does seem sort of 293 00:24:06.660 --> 00:24:08.439 Aaron McHale: unclear. As to 294 00:24:08.760 --> 00:24:10.979 Aaron McHale: are we talking, you know. Are you talking about like 295 00:24:11.770 --> 00:24:14.991 Aaron McHale: the current state of the content or the revision. 296 00:24:15.430 --> 00:24:20.129 Aaron McHale: so so I think that's a good, a good sort of line of thinking to be on. 297 00:24:21.380 --> 00:24:23.090 benji: Okay, let's 298 00:24:26.440 --> 00:24:28.800 benji: let me use my browser tools to make 299 00:24:29.200 --> 00:24:30.950 benji: some suggestions. 300 00:24:36.250 --> 00:24:38.019 benji: there's this. Div. 301 00:24:39.770 --> 00:24:43.470 benji: This is just a div just kind of in any way. 302 00:24:44.420 --> 00:24:45.060 benji: Lose. 303 00:24:48.840 --> 00:24:50.040 benji: Make this label 304 00:24:52.010 --> 00:24:53.130 benji: latest 305 00:24:53.510 --> 00:24:54.650 benji: division. 306 00:25:04.080 --> 00:25:04.930 benji: Yeah. 307 00:25:05.430 --> 00:25:07.249 benji: Who could have say. 308 00:25:08.390 --> 00:25:09.720 benji: label. 309 00:25:15.090 --> 00:25:16.030 benji: a 310 00:25:19.800 --> 00:25:21.410 benji: location 311 00:25:23.110 --> 00:25:24.270 benji: published? 312 00:25:37.620 --> 00:25:39.330 benji: Let's see what that would look like. 313 00:25:44.040 --> 00:25:46.130 benji: okay? Well, obviously. 314 00:25:47.040 --> 00:25:49.669 benji: you'd want to change the HTML 315 00:25:50.300 --> 00:25:53.290 benji: elements so that things are on the same line. 316 00:25:57.670 --> 00:25:59.850 benji: but is this moving in the right direction? 317 00:26:11.620 --> 00:26:17.430 Randy Oest (he/him): I'll say one of the things that I liked. I like the copywriting at the one on the bottom. 318 00:26:18.070 --> 00:26:24.770 Randy Oest (he/him): where it said very plainly like there's there's a i forget exactly what it said. But basically like. 319 00:26:24.840 --> 00:26:27.330 Randy Oest (he/him): there's a published version of this page. 320 00:26:28.300 --> 00:26:30.150 Randy Oest (he/him): and that 321 00:26:30.250 --> 00:26:33.309 Randy Oest (he/him): I felt like communicated it pretty clearly. And 322 00:26:33.400 --> 00:26:35.570 Randy Oest (he/him): one thing I'm uncertain about 323 00:26:36.286 --> 00:26:38.153 Randy Oest (he/him): is, you know how 324 00:26:38.910 --> 00:26:44.400 Randy Oest (he/him): how M. Like, how much we need to bring this to the attention of 325 00:26:44.560 --> 00:27:02.780 Randy Oest (he/him): folks. Where, when this happens is this something that like if we just had like plain text status update, that's fine, because we're communicating it well, or is this something that a lot of people get have a great deal of confusion about, and that we should maybe like throw some like alarms, saying, Hey. 326 00:27:02.790 --> 00:27:08.499 Randy Oest (he/him): you know, this has. The the page is still live. You're just making revisions that haven't been pushed live yet. 327 00:27:10.740 --> 00:27:11.626 benji: Yeah, we 328 00:27:12.150 --> 00:27:16.047 benji: we considered the possibility of having a status message. 329 00:27:16.660 --> 00:27:22.010 benji: and that might be the right thing to do. But, on the other hand, it can also lead to 330 00:27:22.643 --> 00:27:24.910 benji: sort of alarm fatigue, because. 331 00:27:24.910 --> 00:27:25.840 Randy Oest (he/him): Umhm. Yeah. 332 00:27:26.175 --> 00:27:28.860 benji: That that message will be there so often. 333 00:27:29.220 --> 00:27:34.357 benji: and we're we're sort of leaning towards saying, Well, this is just the current status. 334 00:27:35.300 --> 00:27:37.479 benji: that information should be here. 335 00:27:40.086 --> 00:27:41.950 benji: And yeah, the text 336 00:27:43.700 --> 00:27:45.150 benji: at the bottom 337 00:27:45.630 --> 00:27:46.520 benji: servants 338 00:27:46.650 --> 00:27:48.360 benji: full sentence, that's good. 339 00:27:48.930 --> 00:27:52.450 benji: A previous revision of this note is published. 340 00:27:53.270 --> 00:27:55.370 benji: So we we could just. 341 00:27:57.230 --> 00:28:03.756 Randy Oest (he/him): Yeah, I would want to lift that into those 2 sentences like, I, I personally like the link that says, see all revisions? 342 00:28:04.405 --> 00:28:20.279 Randy Oest (he/him): That's an affordance for users who maybe like don't know that one of the tabs are revisions. I work with a lot of users of drupal sites who like editing the drupal site is something that they don't do very often, so every little affordance we can give them helps them. 343 00:28:24.870 --> 00:28:29.699 Randy Oest (he/him): Now this is all just my 2 cents like. I know that that you've all been working on this already. I'm just 344 00:28:30.060 --> 00:28:31.520 Randy Oest (he/him): asking some questions. 345 00:28:31.740 --> 00:28:33.040 Randy Oest (he/him): I'm trying to be helpful. 346 00:28:34.030 --> 00:28:34.670 benji: Sure. 347 00:28:35.810 --> 00:28:37.350 Aaron McHale: Yeah, I think that's like. 348 00:28:37.740 --> 00:28:41.980 Aaron McHale: no, I think that's really Val, like a really valuable insight, because one of the like 349 00:28:42.100 --> 00:28:46.669 Aaron McHale: one of the strengths of these meetings as Benjy will talk about is that where we have 350 00:28:46.690 --> 00:28:51.909 Aaron McHale: a diverse set of viewpoints and perspectives? We get better results. So 351 00:28:52.080 --> 00:28:55.443 Aaron McHale: I think it's what you're saying is really important. And 352 00:28:55.890 --> 00:29:02.249 Aaron McHale: it's kind of similar to something I was saying last week. Actually, where Cms that we have 353 00:29:02.583 --> 00:29:15.780 Aaron McHale: that a lot of our edges work with it makes it essentially makes it really clear, like, what's gonna happen after you save the form cause, I think, and from what I've observed, that's what's important to people, it's like, if when I go here. 354 00:29:15.890 --> 00:29:18.690 Aaron McHale: I just want some certainty that either 355 00:29:19.130 --> 00:29:29.560 Aaron McHale: I'm you know that I'm not gonna be like changing the published version. Or I'm gonna this is gonna be a new draft. And I feel like the problem with the current form is to a degree like you're maybe not 356 00:29:29.700 --> 00:29:36.309 Aaron McHale: like, we're not giving enough certainty in some ways. So I guess part of the way that we do that is, we communicate, like. 357 00:29:37.140 --> 00:29:48.958 Aaron McHale: you know, the the name of the using, using, like the name of the tabs, and like using the the submit buttons and things to communicate like, what's gonna happen like is this gonna be published? This is gonna be, you know, saved as a draft, that kind of thing. So 358 00:29:49.250 --> 00:29:54.633 Aaron McHale: I was kind of leaning a similar direction last week, saying, like, you know, maybe we should have some kind of 359 00:29:54.930 --> 00:30:10.190 Aaron McHale: and I don't think we? I think we kind of ran out of time to explore it to in too much detail. But like I was talking about how we have yeah, how we how we've named on our Cms, how we've named the tabs, and how we've named the buttons and things to make it really clear and give you that certainty like, if you're going here. 360 00:30:11.140 --> 00:30:15.389 Aaron McHale: you know, you're gonna be saving a draft, or you're gonna be saving the published version or whatever. So. 361 00:30:20.380 --> 00:30:21.170 benji: Okay? 362 00:30:22.180 --> 00:30:26.549 benji: I am. I am, by the way, modifying the text a little bit 363 00:30:26.850 --> 00:30:33.190 benji: to be consistent, that we have this link labeled revisions, and this link is going to the same place. 364 00:30:33.300 --> 00:30:37.659 benji: So I like to give it the same link text, although that's 365 00:30:38.230 --> 00:30:39.319 benji: and for discussion. 366 00:30:39.370 --> 00:30:40.590 benji: Go ahead, Ralph. 367 00:30:42.066 --> 00:30:44.290 Ralf Koller: One detail I'm 368 00:30:45.060 --> 00:30:51.110 Ralf Koller: still not very comfortable with the label for that for the moderation state 369 00:30:51.310 --> 00:30:53.089 Ralf Koller: with latest provision. 370 00:30:53.741 --> 00:30:57.349 Ralf Koller: If we would have gone with the pattern 371 00:30:58.555 --> 00:31:01.299 Ralf Koller: with a board labels 372 00:31:01.879 --> 00:31:08.619 Ralf Koller: like underneath, with last saved author for the moderation state and the current version published. 373 00:31:09.416 --> 00:31:13.940 Ralf Koller: Then I would see some sort of 374 00:31:15.590 --> 00:31:16.490 Ralf Koller: Oh. 375 00:31:16.950 --> 00:31:19.580 Ralf Koller: pro argument for that. But 376 00:31:19.880 --> 00:31:21.120 Ralf Koller: still it's 377 00:31:21.960 --> 00:31:34.139 Ralf Koller: yeah. I would label it what it is. And it's basically the moderation state in here, so I wouldn't call it necessarily latest revision. And, on the other hand, I like the idea to simply 378 00:31:34.300 --> 00:31:35.210 Ralf Koller: move 379 00:31:36.550 --> 00:31:42.389 Ralf Koller: that line of a previous revision of this node is published or still published. 380 00:31:43.190 --> 00:31:45.669 Ralf Koller: however, it will be phrased. But yeah. 381 00:31:45.700 --> 00:31:47.360 Ralf Koller: as basically a sub 382 00:31:48.280 --> 00:31:51.720 Ralf Koller: text of that or a description for that 383 00:31:52.250 --> 00:31:55.559 Ralf Koller: motivation stage might be 384 00:31:56.650 --> 00:31:58.096 Ralf Koller: doable. Yeah. 385 00:32:02.410 --> 00:32:04.680 benji: Okay? So yeah, let's 386 00:32:05.860 --> 00:32:09.259 benji: try to make the formatting a little more consistent. I'll 387 00:32:09.520 --> 00:32:12.580 benji: I'll be a little lazy and just use sort of 388 00:32:13.320 --> 00:32:14.860 benji: bold tags. 389 00:32:21.640 --> 00:32:22.420 benji: and 390 00:32:23.170 --> 00:32:24.930 benji: so just this N. 391 00:32:31.250 --> 00:32:32.130 benji: And and 392 00:32:39.040 --> 00:32:40.150 benji: spoiled. 393 00:32:46.780 --> 00:32:50.429 Randy Oest (he/him): For what it's worth. I put some text into the chat 394 00:32:51.430 --> 00:32:53.730 Randy Oest (he/him): just doing a little bit of copywriting 395 00:32:54.120 --> 00:32:55.380 Randy Oest (he/him): like, I think 396 00:32:55.710 --> 00:32:57.330 Randy Oest (he/him): you are editing 397 00:32:57.370 --> 00:32:58.960 Randy Oest (he/him): colon draft 398 00:32:59.480 --> 00:33:04.360 Randy Oest (he/him): a previous version, which would link to the previous version. Directly 399 00:33:04.470 --> 00:33:10.669 Randy Oest (he/him): of this node is published, see all revisions with revisions being a link to the revisions tab. 400 00:33:11.000 --> 00:33:17.539 Randy Oest (he/him): And then this draft was last saved date. And then, like just author, author admin 401 00:33:17.730 --> 00:33:19.489 Randy Oest (he/him): and I feel like that helps 402 00:33:19.720 --> 00:33:24.479 Randy Oest (he/him): like cause. One of the things that I see here with last saved, and the date 403 00:33:24.670 --> 00:33:29.089 Randy Oest (he/him): especially with it being underneath text that says a previous revision, it's like 404 00:33:29.520 --> 00:33:33.440 Randy Oest (he/him): what was last save the previous revision or the draft. I'm working on. 405 00:33:34.740 --> 00:33:35.500 benji: Okay. 406 00:33:40.530 --> 00:33:41.630 benji: so 407 00:33:42.960 --> 00:33:49.404 benji: is that accurate and is that the terminology that we use elsewhere? 408 00:33:52.520 --> 00:33:54.030 benji: you are editing? 409 00:33:55.080 --> 00:34:00.519 benji: You're editing revision, and I I think the word revision should be in there 410 00:34:01.570 --> 00:34:02.720 benji: somewhere. 411 00:34:08.219 --> 00:34:09.750 benji: so Ralph suggests 412 00:34:09.989 --> 00:34:11.120 benji: changing. 413 00:34:11.320 --> 00:34:13.869 benji: This revision was last saved. 414 00:34:16.150 --> 00:34:17.420 benji: although. 415 00:34:29.420 --> 00:34:30.899 benji: I mean, in a sense. 416 00:34:32.590 --> 00:34:33.690 benji: you're you're not 417 00:34:33.790 --> 00:34:40.460 benji: editing a revision. You're creating a new revision based on the previous revision. Right? 418 00:34:48.900 --> 00:34:49.889 Aaron McHale: Yeah, cause the 419 00:34:50.010 --> 00:34:52.719 Aaron McHale: great rear vision check box is checked and 420 00:34:53.590 --> 00:34:56.369 Aaron McHale: interesting. You can't disable it. I wonder if that's 421 00:34:56.500 --> 00:34:57.490 Aaron McHale: because. 422 00:35:01.490 --> 00:35:06.070 Aaron McHale: is that like a content moderation thing that you can't create multiple revisions? Or 423 00:35:14.700 --> 00:35:18.209 Aaron McHale: or is it because revisions are required? I see the text below it. 424 00:35:18.560 --> 00:35:19.410 Aaron McHale: Yeah. 425 00:35:30.370 --> 00:35:32.620 Aaron McHale: I mean for what it's worth. We definitely shouldn't 426 00:35:32.840 --> 00:35:34.219 Aaron McHale: say, Node. 427 00:35:34.230 --> 00:35:37.229 Aaron McHale: as we're trying to move away from the word node and the interface. 428 00:35:40.520 --> 00:35:43.070 benji: And and also the 429 00:35:43.290 --> 00:35:44.420 benji: the current 430 00:35:44.680 --> 00:35:47.630 benji: merge request on the issue only applies to nodes. 431 00:35:47.840 --> 00:35:51.690 benji: But we would probably want this for taxonomy terms. 432 00:35:51.690 --> 00:35:52.410 Aaron McHale: Yeah. 433 00:35:52.630 --> 00:35:54.809 benji: And other content. 434 00:35:55.050 --> 00:35:57.829 benji: If if that content is moderated. 435 00:35:58.660 --> 00:36:01.859 benji: I don't know. I've never seen a site where anything other than nodes is 436 00:36:02.020 --> 00:36:02.490 benji: control. 437 00:36:02.490 --> 00:36:02.850 Aaron McHale: Well, th-. 438 00:36:02.850 --> 00:36:04.169 benji: And moderation of you. 439 00:36:05.190 --> 00:36:13.080 Aaron McHale: Yeah, it's definitely possible. And funny mentioned, because I've I've just been working on something for a site where it needs 440 00:36:13.513 --> 00:36:18.169 Aaron McHale: taxonomies to be moderated. And as of 10.3, that's 441 00:36:18.560 --> 00:36:19.969 Aaron McHale: gonna be possible. 442 00:36:20.020 --> 00:36:24.524 Aaron McHale: That was committed in 10.3. So yeah, it's definitely possible. 443 00:36:25.330 --> 00:36:43.310 Aaron McHale: and you can even apply work. You can create workflows and apply them to users and other things. So especially given. The amount of work that was put in to make the revision ui itself like generic. So it can be, you know. You'll see now, blocks and taxonomies and things also have a revision. Ui! So it'd be great if we could try and keep consistency. 444 00:36:48.870 --> 00:36:50.560 benji: Okay. So 445 00:36:56.190 --> 00:36:57.669 benji: offer has to leave. 446 00:36:58.710 --> 00:37:03.146 benji: So let's go through Randy's suggestion. Sort of line by line. 447 00:37:05.400 --> 00:37:10.480 benji: who thinks that we should add something like you are editing to the 1st line up here. 448 00:37:17.342 --> 00:37:19.459 benji: I get a thumbs up from Aaron 449 00:37:22.340 --> 00:37:25.330 benji: and presumably thumbs up from Randy 450 00:37:26.110 --> 00:37:27.730 benji: Ralph. Any opinion. 451 00:37:30.390 --> 00:37:33.880 Ralf Koller: No strong opinion either or so. 452 00:37:39.740 --> 00:37:44.581 Aaron McHale: The only thing I might do, and this is possibly a follow up is to be mindful that 453 00:37:45.261 --> 00:37:57.228 Aaron McHale: if that that's true, as long as you also don't change the moderation state, so we might want something where like, I don't know if it's possible for then that text to like change in real time. If you also change the moderation state 454 00:37:57.988 --> 00:38:00.359 Aaron McHale: in the dropdown, because that would then. 455 00:38:01.010 --> 00:38:03.449 Aaron McHale: if you do that, you would then make like, you know. 456 00:38:04.050 --> 00:38:08.514 Aaron McHale: editing well, would you still be? Does that text still apply? 457 00:38:09.860 --> 00:38:11.693 Aaron McHale: I close the chat window? 458 00:38:14.390 --> 00:38:16.869 Aaron McHale: because then it's like you. You will be 459 00:38:17.310 --> 00:38:18.210 Aaron McHale: like 460 00:38:19.300 --> 00:38:26.180 Aaron McHale: it will no longer be what you're editing will become like, published or in review, or whatever the next stage is, rather than draft. 461 00:38:29.040 --> 00:38:31.480 benji: Yeah, I I guess it seems to me that. 462 00:38:33.560 --> 00:38:36.049 benji: that suggests that the 463 00:38:37.800 --> 00:38:39.910 benji: yeah on the revision tab. 464 00:38:40.790 --> 00:38:43.050 benji: If I'm editing a revision. 465 00:38:44.230 --> 00:38:47.010 benji: then, yeah, I'll still have 466 00:38:47.500 --> 00:38:52.360 benji: the 2 revisions. And this this one that I'm editing is going to change. 467 00:38:52.370 --> 00:38:54.300 benji: and that's inaccurate. 468 00:38:54.950 --> 00:38:56.659 benji: So I kind of don't like 469 00:38:57.170 --> 00:38:59.509 benji: saying that you are editing revision. 470 00:38:59.520 --> 00:39:01.259 benji: Randy? Did you want to add something. 471 00:39:01.820 --> 00:39:03.980 Randy Oest (he/him): No, that's that's fine. I'm just 472 00:39:05.083 --> 00:39:07.910 Randy Oest (he/him): I just am throwing out suggestions. I don't. 473 00:39:07.940 --> 00:39:14.519 Randy Oest (he/him): I? I think that I see how it gets a little bit more robust and complicated, and maybe we 474 00:39:14.780 --> 00:39:19.509 Randy Oest (he/him): need to talk in terms of what the status of it is, instead of what the user is doing. 475 00:39:21.570 --> 00:39:23.170 benji: Right and 476 00:39:23.300 --> 00:39:29.420 benji: points out, there's another issue. This is 2, 8, 9, 9, 7, 1 9. 477 00:39:29.800 --> 00:39:33.820 benji: Revision version. Language on revision listing page is misleading 478 00:39:34.100 --> 00:39:36.570 benji: with content. Moderation enabled 479 00:39:37.170 --> 00:39:41.030 benji: so that would affect this page. Right. Ralph. 480 00:39:43.180 --> 00:39:43.694 Ralf Koller: Yes. 481 00:39:44.730 --> 00:39:45.430 benji: Okay. 482 00:39:54.060 --> 00:39:58.690 Ralf Koller: But it's also connected to the node edit page, and the terminology used there. So. 483 00:40:20.080 --> 00:40:21.200 benji: Let's save. 484 00:40:24.310 --> 00:40:27.307 benji: So we don't have a consensus. Here, let me 485 00:40:28.890 --> 00:40:31.119 benji: for the sake of discussions. 486 00:40:32.080 --> 00:40:34.090 benji: put in Randy's suggestion. 487 00:40:39.090 --> 00:40:40.770 benji: You wanted something like 488 00:40:41.610 --> 00:40:42.870 benji: not old. 489 00:40:43.580 --> 00:40:46.510 benji: You are editing 490 00:40:48.360 --> 00:40:49.690 benji: a 491 00:40:54.280 --> 00:40:56.539 benji: did you actually want all caps for draft? 492 00:40:57.705 --> 00:40:58.250 Randy Oest (he/him): No. 493 00:40:58.250 --> 00:40:58.560 benji: Okay. 494 00:40:59.670 --> 00:41:01.430 benji: just indicating that that's 495 00:41:02.040 --> 00:41:04.670 benji: something that that varies. 496 00:41:04.820 --> 00:41:10.289 Randy Oest (he/him): Yeah, we just we need to to call it out. Cause I think the user should see 497 00:41:10.340 --> 00:41:13.940 Randy Oest (he/him): the state of it like should see draft published. 498 00:41:14.250 --> 00:41:16.260 Randy Oest (he/him): whatever status it is. 499 00:41:22.620 --> 00:41:23.509 Randy Oest (he/him): There we go. 500 00:41:23.510 --> 00:41:25.330 benji: Oops left a call. 501 00:41:49.150 --> 00:41:55.530 benji: so let's go into the next line. So I more or less copied 502 00:41:56.080 --> 00:41:59.950 benji: what was in the current merch request, and brandy suggests 503 00:42:02.125 --> 00:42:02.910 benji: making 504 00:42:03.040 --> 00:42:05.700 benji: previous revision a link 505 00:42:07.480 --> 00:42:10.720 benji: saying, a previous revision is published. 506 00:42:11.130 --> 00:42:12.390 benji: And 507 00:42:12.570 --> 00:42:14.039 benji: yeah, let's get rid of 508 00:42:14.690 --> 00:42:16.590 benji: the phrase of this node. 509 00:42:17.130 --> 00:42:21.770 Randy Oest (he/him): Yeah, I posted a second version that said a previous revision is published. 510 00:42:22.970 --> 00:42:23.820 Randy Oest (he/him): So. 511 00:42:24.370 --> 00:42:26.760 benji: Right. I think that's what I'm looking at now. 512 00:42:26.760 --> 00:42:27.470 Randy Oest (he/him): Yeah. 513 00:42:31.360 --> 00:42:33.739 benji: a previous revision. 514 00:42:35.830 --> 00:42:38.729 benji: Let's get rid of of this node. 515 00:42:44.090 --> 00:42:45.070 benji: Perhaps. 516 00:43:03.570 --> 00:43:05.750 benji: So. Go ahead, Ralph. 517 00:43:07.094 --> 00:43:11.835 Ralf Koller: Just one thought in regards of the port of the 1st line. Again. 518 00:43:14.200 --> 00:43:20.199 Ralf Koller: I agree with Randy that yeah, communicating the current state. 519 00:43:20.590 --> 00:43:26.950 Ralf Koller: and that was also the reason why I suggested initially to go simply with the label 520 00:43:27.000 --> 00:43:31.029 Ralf Koller: Moderation state and the label which is used on other pages. 521 00:43:31.835 --> 00:43:32.390 Ralf Koller: Cost 522 00:43:32.750 --> 00:43:34.630 Ralf Koller: the thing I wondered about. 523 00:43:35.490 --> 00:43:41.869 Ralf Koller: the longer I look at it is, do we have anywhere else in the Admin ui 524 00:43:42.380 --> 00:43:50.569 Ralf Koller: micro copy that directly addresses the user like you are editing and do some sort of hand holding 525 00:43:51.610 --> 00:43:54.379 Ralf Koller: and explaining what is currently happening. 526 00:43:54.830 --> 00:43:57.549 Ralf Koller: Some sort of conversational way. 527 00:44:00.070 --> 00:44:02.069 benji: Yeah, I I can't think of any. 528 00:44:02.740 --> 00:44:07.680 benji: So this would be inconsistent with most of the Admin ui. 529 00:44:11.770 --> 00:44:16.939 benji: which is sort of worth considering holistically. And 530 00:44:19.060 --> 00:44:21.150 benji: and perhaps this is not the right 531 00:44:22.127 --> 00:44:26.159 benji: issue to to make large scale changes like that. 532 00:44:26.340 --> 00:44:28.160 benji: In other words, let's let's not 533 00:44:28.420 --> 00:44:32.902 benji: make piecemeal changes if if they're worth making, let's 534 00:44:33.760 --> 00:44:35.080 benji: change the 535 00:44:35.500 --> 00:44:41.039 benji: the tone of of the admin interface all over the place, and not just in in one place at a time. 536 00:44:41.940 --> 00:44:45.590 Ralf Koller: Definitely worth to consider. But yeah, when it's 537 00:44:46.360 --> 00:44:49.360 Ralf Koller: if we are going that way, then do it holistically. 538 00:44:51.140 --> 00:44:53.420 Aaron McHale: What about? For 539 00:44:54.130 --> 00:44:58.720 Aaron McHale: on confirmation steps, like, I think that's like, if you delete something 540 00:44:59.390 --> 00:45:08.140 Aaron McHale: that's probably an example of where we're more directly addressing the user, perhaps trying to remember what that I can't remember off the top of my head. Exactly what that messaging is. 541 00:45:08.907 --> 00:45:11.230 Ralf Koller: Those yeah, the the delete messages 542 00:45:11.520 --> 00:45:13.279 Ralf Koller: do we want to delete 543 00:45:14.200 --> 00:45:16.189 Ralf Koller: Node X, for example. 544 00:45:18.046 --> 00:45:18.879 benji: We don't. 545 00:45:20.390 --> 00:45:22.710 benji: Yeah. I guess deleting a node 546 00:45:24.390 --> 00:45:26.489 benji: gets confirmation form. 547 00:45:30.060 --> 00:45:32.439 Ralf Koller: Are you sure you want to do? Yeah, correctly, Matt. 548 00:45:32.990 --> 00:45:35.579 benji: So that is directly addressing the user. 549 00:45:39.080 --> 00:45:42.866 Ralf Koller: But there is also the point we've already 550 00:45:43.680 --> 00:45:52.720 Ralf Koller: agreed on. I think a few months back or weeks back, to move that question to the body, instead of 551 00:45:53.080 --> 00:45:55.769 Ralf Koller: keeping it in the title, and addressing there 552 00:45:56.410 --> 00:45:58.850 Ralf Koller: the question, and raising the question, there. 553 00:46:00.450 --> 00:46:01.550 benji: That's right. 554 00:46:03.820 --> 00:46:05.340 benji: also 555 00:46:06.760 --> 00:46:08.229 benji: let me 556 00:46:11.370 --> 00:46:13.909 benji: look at another confirmation form. 557 00:46:18.350 --> 00:46:21.800 benji: So I'm pretty sure that if we 558 00:46:22.220 --> 00:46:26.260 benji: delete a field, and again Zoom is getting in the way. 559 00:46:30.100 --> 00:46:30.880 benji: right? 560 00:46:33.450 --> 00:46:35.279 benji: And here again, where 561 00:46:35.670 --> 00:46:36.630 benji: sort of 562 00:46:37.150 --> 00:46:39.469 benji: addressing the user. 563 00:46:42.150 --> 00:46:44.849 benji: and then the main body is 564 00:46:45.310 --> 00:46:48.620 benji: sort of passive voice. This action cannot be undone. 565 00:46:49.730 --> 00:46:53.580 benji: And then information about exactly what changes will be made. 566 00:46:55.820 --> 00:47:01.720 benji: Okay, so so these confirmation forms do have some precedence for directly 567 00:47:02.070 --> 00:47:03.610 benji: addressing the user. 568 00:47:09.530 --> 00:47:10.849 Aaron McHale: Yeah, I think we tend to 569 00:47:10.900 --> 00:47:12.780 Aaron McHale: prefer the active voice. 570 00:47:13.250 --> 00:47:13.890 benji: Yes. 571 00:47:16.090 --> 00:47:22.720 Aaron McHale: thing I'm in thinking about as well is does this wording work for 572 00:47:25.460 --> 00:47:29.660 Aaron McHale: when the moderation state isn't just draft, like 573 00:47:30.760 --> 00:47:35.880 Aaron McHale: I'm trying to. I'm not sure is the intention that this text would be there for, like 574 00:47:36.890 --> 00:47:48.289 Aaron McHale: it would say, draft on anything that isn't published, or are we talking about? Just, you know, because the current content isn't draft like, if you, if the content was in review, would this read 575 00:47:48.460 --> 00:47:55.930 Aaron McHale: correctly? Also, keeping in mind that, like the revision stages, are entirely arbitrary, and you, the site, can define its own 576 00:47:55.970 --> 00:47:58.829 Aaron McHale: content. Moderation stages, however, it wants. 577 00:48:00.430 --> 00:48:06.370 benji: Yeah, that's a good point. So I think we have here, just the default states of draft and published. 578 00:48:06.920 --> 00:48:07.975 benji: And 579 00:48:10.150 --> 00:48:12.150 benji: or would that be under structure? 580 00:48:12.440 --> 00:48:17.109 benji: No, it's not under construction, is it? Configuration, workflow? 581 00:48:35.880 --> 00:48:42.539 Randy Oest (he/him): While you're looking for that. I posted a screenshot. I went in and edited 582 00:48:42.900 --> 00:48:57.070 Randy Oest (he/him): the bar as it is before we started going going in and the sidebar before we went in and started editing it, and I just added, the previous revision is published. See all revisions underneath the word draft, which was the status 583 00:48:58.151 --> 00:49:01.760 Randy Oest (he/him): and maybe this is sufficient. 584 00:49:05.560 --> 00:49:08.920 Randy Oest (he/him): It keeps it kind of simple, and we don't have to 585 00:49:08.930 --> 00:49:24.979 Randy Oest (he/him): like. I personally like dialogue that talks to the user. That kind of makes more of a connection. But I also know that a lot of the like, the node stuff is more like straightforward statusy. Except for when we're trying to engage the user in an action. 586 00:49:25.080 --> 00:49:26.940 Randy Oest (he/him): So maybe this is. 587 00:49:27.370 --> 00:49:28.640 Randy Oest (he/him): maybe this is good. 588 00:49:31.970 --> 00:49:32.810 benji: Okay. 589 00:49:33.300 --> 00:49:34.250 benji: So 590 00:49:34.700 --> 00:49:35.629 benji: yeah, I was 591 00:49:36.740 --> 00:49:38.790 benji: going to say, 1st of all. 592 00:49:40.437 --> 00:49:42.169 benji: where was I? 593 00:49:43.726 --> 00:49:49.379 benji: As Aaron was saying, the moderation states we can add new ones, and we. 594 00:49:49.460 --> 00:49:51.449 benji: I think we can also declare 595 00:49:54.010 --> 00:49:57.219 benji: which ones correspond to being published right? 596 00:50:01.200 --> 00:50:07.069 Aaron McHale: I think you can only set the draft, and I think published is is coded in as the published state, for 597 00:50:07.760 --> 00:50:10.719 Aaron McHale: probably for technical reasons. 598 00:50:18.850 --> 00:50:20.280 benji: Yeah, and any 599 00:50:20.340 --> 00:50:21.880 benji: moderation state. 600 00:50:23.570 --> 00:50:25.419 benji: why can't I edit this? 601 00:50:27.930 --> 00:50:30.250 benji: We have these 2 check boxes. 602 00:50:32.382 --> 00:50:33.890 benji: When I created. 603 00:50:34.570 --> 00:50:35.919 Aaron McHale: Think his draft. 604 00:50:36.020 --> 00:50:40.850 Aaron McHale: Yeah, cause draft is maybe if you add it like archived, you can change it because 605 00:50:41.510 --> 00:50:44.229 Aaron McHale: I think draft is because it's the initial state. 606 00:50:44.490 --> 00:50:45.400 Aaron McHale: E-bay. 607 00:50:46.620 --> 00:50:47.390 benji: Okay. 608 00:50:48.130 --> 00:50:50.060 Aaron McHale: Oh, you can, said, it's published. Okay? 609 00:50:50.880 --> 00:50:51.510 Aaron McHale: Thought about that. 610 00:50:51.510 --> 00:50:53.986 benji: So so there's there's a lot of 611 00:50:54.630 --> 00:50:57.610 benji: freedom, and how the moderation works. 612 00:50:58.180 --> 00:50:58.910 benji: That 613 00:51:03.680 --> 00:51:09.290 benji: Let's see, one thing you can't do is delete the published state. I see. 614 00:51:09.510 --> 00:51:12.060 benji: I guess draft and published are. 615 00:51:12.910 --> 00:51:16.170 benji: or cannot be, deleted, but any new state that I add 616 00:51:16.300 --> 00:51:18.950 benji: I have the option of making it 617 00:51:19.870 --> 00:51:23.769 benji: published. When Content reaches this date it should be published. 618 00:51:26.870 --> 00:51:30.760 benji: so there's sort of a relation between the moderation state 619 00:51:30.880 --> 00:51:32.410 benji: and the 620 00:51:32.590 --> 00:51:33.690 benji: core 621 00:51:33.750 --> 00:51:35.130 benji: status 622 00:51:35.770 --> 00:51:38.069 benji: field in the database which is 623 00:51:38.180 --> 00:51:39.839 benji: published or unpublished. 624 00:51:45.020 --> 00:51:46.330 benji: so 625 00:51:46.808 --> 00:51:51.590 benji: looking at this screenshot, or I think that's what I currently have 626 00:51:52.160 --> 00:51:55.299 benji: post what I currently have over here 2 links here. 627 00:51:55.983 --> 00:52:01.990 benji: My original suggestion was not to have any links here, because we're already have your revisions. Link. 628 00:52:04.880 --> 00:52:09.040 benji: I don't like giving the user too many links. 629 00:52:09.260 --> 00:52:13.040 benji: because a link is an option, and that leads to 630 00:52:13.220 --> 00:52:14.890 benji: decision, fatigue. 631 00:52:15.100 --> 00:52:17.129 benji: And I don't know how often 632 00:52:17.450 --> 00:52:23.439 benji: someone is going to want to go to the link for the previous revision from this page. 633 00:52:24.372 --> 00:52:26.459 benji: I think just the 634 00:52:26.740 --> 00:52:29.920 benji: linked to the revisions page is more useful. 635 00:52:30.460 --> 00:52:34.200 benji: So I'd I'd sort of like to to compromise on having 636 00:52:34.810 --> 00:52:37.310 benji: single link here. So let's 637 00:52:37.720 --> 00:52:38.846 benji: let's try 638 00:52:39.870 --> 00:52:41.560 benji: Ralph's suggestion 639 00:52:42.290 --> 00:52:43.580 benji: that we 640 00:52:47.160 --> 00:52:48.610 benji: label this 641 00:52:53.000 --> 00:52:55.560 benji: as moderation stage right? Ralph. 642 00:52:57.730 --> 00:52:58.035 Ralf Koller: Yes. 643 00:53:04.570 --> 00:53:07.560 benji: So that has the virtue of consistency. 644 00:53:09.220 --> 00:53:12.470 benji: I'm going to make this no longer 645 00:53:13.520 --> 00:53:14.460 benji: a link. 646 00:53:15.380 --> 00:53:18.569 Ralf Koller: And it's also more flexible in regards. Whatever 647 00:53:18.790 --> 00:53:20.540 Ralf Koller: moderations that you'll have. 648 00:53:20.670 --> 00:53:21.680 Ralf Koller: it will work. 649 00:53:26.440 --> 00:53:27.520 benji: Somehow 650 00:53:27.710 --> 00:53:30.559 benji: I have it in my head that strong 651 00:53:30.880 --> 00:53:33.380 benji: is an HTML tag. 652 00:53:33.840 --> 00:53:37.230 benji: that that bold is an HTML tag, when of course, it's just be. 653 00:53:42.260 --> 00:53:47.789 Randy Oest (he/him): It feels like it should be a thing right? Cause. If there's be, why not just do both and have them do the same thing? 654 00:53:51.540 --> 00:53:55.398 benji: which of course, you can do with a web components. But anyway, 655 00:53:58.410 --> 00:53:59.480 benji: soaps 656 00:54:02.620 --> 00:54:03.570 benji: otherwise. 657 00:54:05.440 --> 00:54:06.085 Aaron McHale: Think 658 00:54:08.430 --> 00:54:09.850 Aaron McHale: it is it 659 00:54:10.200 --> 00:54:13.750 Aaron McHale: because the user gonna understand what moderation state means? Because 660 00:54:15.020 --> 00:54:20.299 Aaron McHale: to me, I don't. That doesn't feel any more clear than when it just said Draft 661 00:54:21.930 --> 00:54:27.160 Aaron McHale: like, I don't really even I don't fully feel like I understand. 662 00:54:28.050 --> 00:54:33.499 Aaron McHale: because I think it's still the same. I think it's still the same like part of the same problem of like. 663 00:54:35.380 --> 00:54:37.029 Aaron McHale: how do I? You know? 664 00:54:37.170 --> 00:54:39.699 Aaron McHale: How do I know that when I can't save 665 00:54:39.740 --> 00:54:40.800 Aaron McHale: I'm not going to 666 00:54:41.510 --> 00:54:44.940 Aaron McHale: edit the public. I'm not gonna like result in something being published. Or 667 00:54:45.260 --> 00:54:49.619 Aaron McHale: maybe that's not the problem, but it feels like part of it is the problem. I guess. 668 00:54:50.530 --> 00:54:53.720 benji: So briefly. My idea is that 669 00:54:54.464 --> 00:54:57.859 benji: the text up here should describe current state. 670 00:54:58.000 --> 00:55:01.989 benji: and what will happen next is something that we can add 671 00:55:02.130 --> 00:55:03.420 benji: down here. 672 00:55:03.948 --> 00:55:05.899 benji: And Ralph, do you have something that. 673 00:55:06.310 --> 00:55:09.910 Ralf Koller: Just to Erin's point in regards of moderation state, because 674 00:55:10.150 --> 00:55:21.419 Ralf Koller: down there, where Benji is currently scroll to, you're already using State, and if moderation state up there in the advanced column confuses you. Then state at the bottom. 675 00:55:21.550 --> 00:55:23.580 Ralf Koller: Won't ring a bell as well. So. 676 00:55:24.520 --> 00:55:25.310 Ralf Koller: and that way. 677 00:55:25.310 --> 00:55:25.920 Aaron McHale: Died. 678 00:55:28.090 --> 00:55:28.819 Ralf Koller: Go ahead! 679 00:55:29.310 --> 00:55:34.989 Aaron McHale: So I was gonna say, is down there. It doesn't say moderation state, though, so like we'd be introducing a new 680 00:55:35.060 --> 00:55:37.340 Aaron McHale: like a word here that isn't 681 00:55:37.860 --> 00:55:40.509 Aaron McHale: used. It just says current state. 682 00:55:42.530 --> 00:55:43.380 Aaron McHale: But 683 00:55:44.220 --> 00:55:47.610 Aaron McHale: if it's already down there, I mean, it's already down there like. 684 00:55:50.180 --> 00:55:53.110 Aaron McHale: So now I'm wondering like, because it's already down. There. 685 00:55:55.870 --> 00:56:03.000 Aaron McHale: Are. Are we like adding on an unnecessary amount of information by also putting it in the sidebar. 686 00:56:14.890 --> 00:56:18.540 benji: Well, we we are duplicating information. But 687 00:56:22.390 --> 00:56:24.780 benji: that's not always a bad thing. 688 00:56:25.160 --> 00:56:29.569 benji: and I think current state information belongs here. 689 00:56:35.640 --> 00:56:36.350 Ralf Koller: Input. 690 00:56:37.180 --> 00:56:37.760 benji: Go ahead! 691 00:56:37.930 --> 00:56:41.639 Ralf Koller: In particular. If you land on the page and just want to get a 692 00:56:41.810 --> 00:56:55.590 Ralf Koller: top level overview about the current situation for that node that way you have the title as well as the top of the advanced column with moderation. State current revision published. Yes, no. Last saved, and author, and that way. 693 00:56:55.730 --> 00:57:00.869 Ralf Koller: You know most of the details necessary to get a top-level overview. 694 00:57:05.510 --> 00:57:10.610 benji: Yeah, I I agree with that. I I also think that this current formatting is 695 00:57:10.640 --> 00:57:12.459 benji: fairly easy to scan. 696 00:57:12.850 --> 00:57:16.230 benji: Right? We have these bold labels. 697 00:57:18.080 --> 00:57:24.459 benji: and yeah, we we don't need to do too much formatting to indicate that this. 698 00:57:24.500 --> 00:57:26.200 benji: These 2 sentences 699 00:57:26.700 --> 00:57:30.110 benji: are related to the moderation state. 700 00:57:31.687 --> 00:57:35.082 benji: So so I think that's fairly easy to scan 701 00:57:38.140 --> 00:57:39.070 benji: And I 702 00:57:39.550 --> 00:57:45.000 benji: I guess we we don't have consensus, but I still believe that having the revisions tab up here 703 00:57:45.330 --> 00:57:49.099 benji: means we don't really need to duplicate it here, which would 704 00:57:49.290 --> 00:57:53.000 benji: at least at this screen, with what this fit on a single line. 705 00:57:58.110 --> 00:58:05.339 Aaron McHale: The other thing we have to keep in mind from an accessibility perspective is that we need to make sure that links can stand on their own. So 706 00:58:05.580 --> 00:58:11.820 Aaron McHale: the example I quite often use a few. S, we need a user. And you're tabbing through all of the links on the page. 707 00:58:11.980 --> 00:58:20.840 Aaron McHale: Will that link make sense out of context? So that's a really important thing when it comes to any links, which is why we generally always have descriptive link. Text. 708 00:58:23.360 --> 00:58:24.510 Aaron McHale: so. 709 00:58:24.710 --> 00:58:29.989 Aaron McHale: yeah, we just always have to bear that in mind as well that any link text has to stand on its own. 710 00:58:30.520 --> 00:58:33.150 benji: So that's part of why I 711 00:58:33.170 --> 00:58:38.140 benji: chose to make just the single word revisions the link. Because we already have 712 00:58:38.590 --> 00:58:43.089 benji: a link with yeah, goes to the same place with the same text. 713 00:58:43.490 --> 00:58:46.609 benji: so that should not add to the confusion. 714 00:58:46.720 --> 00:58:48.630 benji: If we use the same 715 00:58:48.680 --> 00:58:51.660 benji: text, and this for the same link elsewhere on the page. 716 00:58:56.840 --> 00:59:01.040 benji: So I'm not sure. Are we get? Are we approaching consensus, or do we still 717 00:59:02.380 --> 00:59:04.210 benji: have differing opinions here. 718 00:59:07.404 --> 00:59:07.740 Randy Oest (he/him): Good. 719 00:59:08.750 --> 00:59:15.248 Aaron McHale: I have a I have another thing that's in my head about like current revision. Published. Yes, 720 00:59:16.520 --> 00:59:17.560 Aaron McHale: While 721 00:59:18.910 --> 00:59:21.189 Aaron McHale: I don't know if I should have a question mark. But 722 00:59:21.360 --> 00:59:24.000 Aaron McHale: I also again, I'm I'm like 723 00:59:25.810 --> 00:59:28.360 Aaron McHale: the word current is used 724 00:59:29.290 --> 00:59:30.430 Aaron McHale: to 725 00:59:30.980 --> 00:59:32.130 Aaron McHale: mean 726 00:59:32.490 --> 00:59:38.341 Aaron McHale: like, if you go down to the bottom of the page. It says like, what does it say? The the current? 727 00:59:41.110 --> 00:59:45.789 benji: So current revision is the term used here on the revisions page. 728 00:59:46.580 --> 00:59:47.909 benji: and you want to go look at the bottom. 729 00:59:47.910 --> 00:59:51.861 Aaron McHale: Yeah, is that? Where does it say? Yes. So it says, 730 00:59:53.310 --> 00:59:54.869 Aaron McHale: okay. So that says 731 00:59:57.270 --> 00:59:59.280 Aaron McHale: that use the word current there. 732 01:00:07.700 --> 01:00:08.800 Aaron McHale: see? That's a bit 733 01:00:09.360 --> 01:00:15.319 Aaron McHale: slightly could be confusing. Because, yeah, here we're using the word current to mean 734 01:00:15.760 --> 01:00:23.039 Aaron McHale: they're like the version you're working with, which is the latest version, but on the revisions tab we use the word current to mean. 735 01:00:24.280 --> 01:00:25.140 Aaron McHale: like. 736 01:00:25.310 --> 01:00:27.500 Aaron McHale: what is the published version. 737 01:00:29.210 --> 01:00:32.570 benji: Yes, let's be more consistent. Call it moderation state. 738 01:00:51.180 --> 01:00:52.640 benji: And I think 739 01:00:59.130 --> 01:01:03.350 benji: Erin is right. That question mark was a bad choice. 740 01:01:12.670 --> 01:01:18.170 benji: again. Current revision is the term used on the revisions tab, and that's 741 01:01:21.310 --> 01:01:23.310 benji: why I chose it here. 742 01:01:32.740 --> 01:01:36.680 Aaron McHale: I guess, like does in this context. Does current revision mean? 743 01:01:36.720 --> 01:01:39.929 Aaron McHale: Are we intending that to mean like the 744 01:01:40.870 --> 01:01:42.269 Aaron McHale: the version 745 01:01:42.340 --> 01:01:49.740 Aaron McHale: like that? You're what you're working on right now. So like, you're on this edit form. And I'm working on changes. Does that mean 746 01:01:49.870 --> 01:01:50.780 Aaron McHale: like. 747 01:01:52.870 --> 01:01:55.849 Aaron McHale: like, if I see current version published. 748 01:01:56.740 --> 01:02:02.060 Aaron McHale: Does that mean when I hit, save that what I'm saving is going to be published like? Does that mean that 749 01:02:04.340 --> 01:02:08.899 Aaron McHale: the like cause in in your head. If you come to this and it's in draft. 750 01:02:08.970 --> 01:02:16.430 Aaron McHale: you're probably thinking about the current version. You might. You could be thinking about it to mean what's published, or you could be thinking about it to mean 751 01:02:17.280 --> 01:02:18.070 Aaron McHale: what's 752 01:02:18.620 --> 01:02:21.670 Aaron McHale: what the like. The latest revision is in draft. 753 01:02:23.290 --> 01:02:28.430 Aaron McHale: And if yeah, I I feel like that word could mean different things, and to different people. 754 01:02:31.890 --> 01:02:37.950 benji: So Ralph also asks in the chat what should be the copy for the case of no previous provision. 755 01:02:38.060 --> 01:02:42.969 benji: and the suggestion on the issue is this, node has no published revision. 756 01:02:43.730 --> 01:02:46.939 benji: and then again have links. See all revisions. 757 01:02:48.580 --> 01:02:51.600 Ralf Koller: And the second comment was in regards of Aaron's point 758 01:02:52.290 --> 01:02:59.900 Ralf Koller: to verify it's basically the current revision published basically means, is there a published previous version of that node. 759 01:03:01.310 --> 01:03:04.840 Ralf Koller: That is basically what the information is that should be 760 01:03:05.040 --> 01:03:06.350 Ralf Koller: communicated. 761 01:03:14.210 --> 01:03:14.990 benji: So 762 01:03:15.270 --> 01:03:18.150 benji: instead of using current revision, which 763 01:03:18.590 --> 01:03:21.619 benji: is the term we get from the revisions list. 764 01:03:21.830 --> 01:03:24.489 benji: should we call this earlier revision 765 01:03:26.150 --> 01:03:27.760 benji: other revision. 766 01:03:28.160 --> 01:03:29.620 benji: some revision. 767 01:03:30.190 --> 01:03:37.106 Aaron McHale: Do we? Do? We even need that line? Because, like above, we're basically saying, there is a published version. 768 01:03:38.130 --> 01:03:40.340 Aaron McHale: So do we even need this line. 769 01:03:40.600 --> 01:03:41.729 Ralf Koller: Just drag it. 770 01:03:42.250 --> 01:03:51.389 benji: That that that's true. I I was. I suggested this before we we added this. So if if we like the complete sentence, if we think that's clear. 771 01:03:51.440 --> 01:03:53.340 benji: then. Yes, let's strike it. 772 01:03:54.770 --> 01:03:55.510 Aaron McHale: Yeah, it's 773 01:03:56.020 --> 01:03:57.579 Aaron McHale: I think it is because. 774 01:03:57.770 --> 01:04:00.220 Aaron McHale: like moderation states can get quite. 775 01:04:00.520 --> 01:04:03.189 Aaron McHale: You know, they they can get quite complicated. So 776 01:04:03.270 --> 01:04:05.390 Aaron McHale: think the clearer. We can make things. 777 01:04:08.560 --> 01:04:12.630 Ralf Koller: And just one thought for the copy for the 778 01:04:13.050 --> 01:04:14.080 Ralf Koller: other 779 01:04:14.695 --> 01:04:23.410 Ralf Koller: Scenario I've posted with simply adjusting the copy from a previous revision is published to no previous revision is published. 780 01:04:28.330 --> 01:04:29.370 Ralf Koller: In that case. 781 01:04:29.550 --> 01:04:33.069 benji: Yeah, we certainly wouldn't want to talk about nodes. 782 01:04:34.271 --> 01:04:37.400 benji: No previous version is published. Sure. 783 01:04:39.410 --> 01:04:45.950 Ralf Koller: Maybe, is it there necessary at all to see all revisions in that case? Because 784 01:04:47.370 --> 01:04:50.900 Ralf Koller: then we are basically on the latest revision, and 785 01:04:51.620 --> 01:04:54.230 Ralf Koller: and therefore there's no need, isn't it? 786 01:04:59.030 --> 01:05:05.290 benji: Okay, and Randy just had to drop and we are getting very close to the end of the hour. 787 01:05:07.910 --> 01:05:14.189 benji: so again, my, my position is that we never need this because we have durations. 788 01:05:14.420 --> 01:05:15.729 benji: Tab right here. 789 01:05:19.000 --> 01:05:23.049 Ralf Koller: Oh! And Aaron posted a direct message to me. Erin, I guess you want. 790 01:05:23.050 --> 01:05:23.430 Aaron McHale: Oh! 791 01:05:23.430 --> 01:05:24.750 Ralf Koller: Posted globally. 792 01:05:24.750 --> 01:05:28.390 Aaron McHale: I didn't intend that to be a direct message. I find zooms. That's weird. 793 01:05:28.650 --> 01:05:31.630 Ralf Koller: But adjusted is a relevant one and a good one, so. 794 01:05:31.820 --> 01:05:32.490 Aaron McHale: Yeah. 795 01:05:33.800 --> 01:05:35.300 Aaron McHale: yeah, it's a. 796 01:05:36.920 --> 01:05:44.749 Ralf Koller: My worry was about my suggestion. With no previous revision is published that is too close to the other, and could be 797 01:05:45.540 --> 01:05:49.449 Ralf Koller: mixed up, and with Aaron's suggestion there are no published revisions. 798 01:05:51.230 --> 01:05:54.759 Ralf Koller: Something like that in that regard might be. 799 01:05:55.130 --> 01:05:55.880 Ralf Koller: We should. 800 01:05:55.880 --> 01:05:56.530 Aaron McHale: Yeah. 801 01:05:58.520 --> 01:06:04.339 Aaron McHale: it it is also keeping with an more active voice. I guess if we just went with, there are no published 802 01:06:04.700 --> 01:06:05.690 Aaron McHale: provisions. 803 01:06:19.250 --> 01:06:20.250 benji: Oh! 804 01:06:26.410 --> 01:06:27.630 Aaron McHale: Do we need the word? 805 01:06:28.390 --> 01:06:30.481 Aaron McHale: I'm gonna regret suggesting this, but. 806 01:06:31.415 --> 01:06:32.000 benji: 2. 807 01:06:32.000 --> 01:06:34.362 Aaron McHale: Do we need to say like like 808 01:06:34.810 --> 01:06:36.090 Aaron McHale: for instance? 809 01:06:38.400 --> 01:06:40.869 Aaron McHale: alright! But so do we. Something like 810 01:06:41.010 --> 01:06:44.730 Aaron McHale: there are no published revisions of this content, or 811 01:06:45.160 --> 01:06:52.400 Aaron McHale: a previous division of this content is published. I don't know if I like that or not. I'm just trying to think of like ways that it's 812 01:06:52.660 --> 01:06:55.200 Aaron McHale: adding clarification. But 813 01:06:55.300 --> 01:06:58.740 Aaron McHale: that might not make sense. If we're talking about taxonomy. 814 01:06:58.800 --> 01:06:59.980 Aaron McHale: The previous 815 01:07:00.470 --> 01:07:01.870 Aaron McHale: revision of this 816 01:07:01.890 --> 01:07:04.560 Aaron McHale: term is published. Maybe actually. 817 01:07:04.750 --> 01:07:06.709 Aaron McHale: there are no published terms. 818 01:07:07.670 --> 01:07:10.890 Aaron McHale: or the maybe that maybe that could work. I don't. 819 01:07:12.510 --> 01:07:14.530 benji: I think it's case of less is more. 820 01:07:15.760 --> 01:07:16.820 Aaron McHale: Yeah. 821 01:07:16.990 --> 01:07:22.440 benji: I mean this, this whole area is about this piece of content, this note or this taxonomy term. 822 01:07:22.440 --> 01:07:24.719 Aaron McHale: True. Yeah, that's true. 823 01:07:26.430 --> 01:07:28.020 Ralf Koller: I just wonder. 824 01:07:28.160 --> 01:07:30.559 Ralf Koller: is the that case 825 01:07:31.660 --> 01:07:35.579 Ralf Koller: necessary at all? The the there are no published revisions. 826 01:07:35.710 --> 01:07:37.489 Ralf Koller: and shouldn't be just 827 01:07:37.790 --> 01:07:38.980 Ralf Koller: show that 828 01:07:39.850 --> 01:07:43.210 Ralf Koller: a previous revision is published just in. In that case. 829 01:07:43.430 --> 01:07:46.149 Ralf Koller: if that applies and otherwise just leave it out 830 01:07:46.890 --> 01:07:50.730 Ralf Koller: because there are no published traditions could raise confusion. Yeah. 831 01:07:51.145 --> 01:07:51.560 Aaron McHale: Yeah. 832 01:07:51.560 --> 01:07:53.760 Ralf Koller: And simply go with moderation. State 833 01:07:53.790 --> 01:07:55.589 Ralf Koller: published, for example. 834 01:07:55.600 --> 01:07:58.649 Ralf Koller: last saved author. And in case 835 01:07:58.880 --> 01:08:04.620 Ralf Koller: that case of that issue, moderation state draft, then a previous revision is published, and that's it. 836 01:08:06.640 --> 01:08:14.799 Aaron McHale: Yeah, I think I I'd agree, actually, because I I was trying to. There was something didn't quite sit right with me about 837 01:08:15.120 --> 01:08:20.040 Aaron McHale: about what I'd suggest, and I couldn't figure out what it was until you said it, Ralph. But yeah, I think like 838 01:08:20.260 --> 01:08:26.010 Aaron McHale: I think if you're drafting the content before it's published. There's there's a good chance. You probably know that, like. 839 01:08:27.109 --> 01:08:30.600 Aaron McHale: it's in draft feel like we're telling the user something they probably already know. 840 01:08:32.210 --> 01:08:36.139 benji: Yeah, I I agree, too. I don't think we need to message in. In that case. 841 01:08:36.620 --> 01:08:39.999 benji: the only the only confusing case is when there is 842 01:08:40.069 --> 01:08:41.200 benji: a previous 843 01:08:41.340 --> 01:08:44.560 benji: published revision, and we're working on a draft. 844 01:08:44.760 --> 01:08:46.949 benji: That's the only time we should add the message. 845 01:08:48.817 --> 01:08:54.500 benji: Okay, we've made some progress. Still need to figure out how to 846 01:08:55.750 --> 01:08:56.700 benji: change 847 01:08:58.301 --> 01:09:03.938 benji: what changes to make at the bottom of the page to help clarify that. But I I think this is 848 01:09:06.170 --> 01:09:12.889 benji: probably there's room for improvement. But I think this is an improvement over the current state. So 849 01:09:13.279 --> 01:09:13.760 benji: oh. 850 01:09:13.760 --> 01:09:14.080 Aaron McHale: So. 851 01:09:14.080 --> 01:09:15.690 benji: I'll consider that progress. 852 01:09:16.310 --> 01:09:19.160 Aaron McHale: So just to clarify quickly. What did it say? 853 01:09:19.430 --> 01:09:24.050 Aaron McHale: What was, what does it say before? I think we changed it to moderation state. But what was the 854 01:09:24.260 --> 01:09:26.829 Aaron McHale: does it say? Craft? No, just draft. 855 01:09:26.830 --> 01:09:28.200 benji: Duplicate the tab. 856 01:09:28.770 --> 01:09:33.090 Aaron McHale: Oh, not not up there, but back down, down at the bottom where? 857 01:09:33.430 --> 01:09:36.580 Aaron McHale: Yeah, it says, current state down there. Okay. 858 01:09:42.180 --> 01:09:53.409 Aaron McHale: I I guess it's a question of, do we want to just use current state? Because that's what's already on the page, or do we? It cause then, if we change it up there. Then we change it down there. And yeah, I don't know 859 01:09:55.610 --> 01:09:57.119 Aaron McHale: but I it's 860 01:09:57.190 --> 01:10:00.819 Aaron McHale: already 5, 4 min past, and I want to open another conversation. 861 01:10:02.920 --> 01:10:03.520 benji: Right? 862 01:10:04.230 --> 01:10:06.771 benji: Okay, thanks for coming. And 863 01:10:07.657 --> 01:10:10.679 Ralf Koller: Should I comment on the issue with 864 01:10:11.400 --> 01:10:12.170 Ralf Koller: costs 865 01:10:12.780 --> 01:10:18.000 Ralf Koller: to this point? Is there consensus now, or should we revisit it another time? 866 01:10:20.246 --> 01:10:29.030 benji: Yeah, I I think there, there's consensus that this is an improvement over the current state and an improvement over the current merge. Request. 867 01:10:30.170 --> 01:10:30.870 benji: But 868 01:10:31.827 --> 01:10:35.030 benji: but it's sort of not necessarily final. 869 01:10:36.050 --> 01:10:37.719 Ralf Koller: Okay. But at least 870 01:10:38.040 --> 01:10:39.990 Ralf Koller: people on the issue could 871 01:10:40.010 --> 01:10:43.950 Ralf Koller: work on moving the information to the advanced column. 872 01:10:44.050 --> 01:10:48.649 Ralf Koller: Yes, and changing a few labels. And we could still then revisit it and 873 01:10:48.870 --> 01:10:51.640 Ralf Koller: find out maybe a description for 874 01:10:52.090 --> 01:10:53.709 Ralf Koller: the widget at the bottom 875 01:10:54.700 --> 01:10:57.639 Ralf Koller: to clarify it further. There, maybe. 876 01:10:57.850 --> 01:10:58.550 Ralf Koller: Red. 877 01:10:58.670 --> 01:10:59.520 Ralf Koller: Okay. 878 01:11:01.510 --> 01:11:04.649 Ralf Koller: And I'll comment on it later tonight. 879 01:11:04.970 --> 01:11:05.950 benji: Okay. Thank you. 880 01:11:06.570 --> 01:11:07.580 Aaron McHale: Okay. Great. 881 01:11:08.360 --> 01:11:10.489 Ralf Koller: Then have a nice weekend. Everyone. 882 01:11:11.360 --> 01:11:12.650 Aaron McHale: Thanks, bye. 883 01:11:12.650 --> 01:11:13.829 benji: Take care you too. Bye. 884 01:11:13.840 --> 01:11:14.520 Ralf Koller: Bye, bye.