Hi,
and thank you for a great module. I love it.

I'd like to allow my visitors to create their own quizzes for other visitors but it really bothers me that all questions are visible to all quizmakers when they are creating their quizzes.

I read somewhere that this is normal behavior of this module. Why? Is there a way around it? On my website, there really is no reason for people to see other people's questions. I think it gets very confusing, especially with high number of questions.

Thanks
Richard

vetoodle.com

Comments

mbutcher’s picture

Category: support » feature

For historical reasons, that's the way Quiz works. Obviously, it scales very poorly.

I'd really like to change this, and I've marked it as an item for v. 3... but I need to nail down some rules and a decent UI. How do we determine what questions should show? How configurable should this be? How do we successfully handle cases where there are, say, 1000 questions?

When I feel like I've got a good path forward, I'll start working on this. Do you have some suggestions?

Matt

mbutcher’s picture

In #368685: Limit available questions to control page length and loading time the suggestion was made that tagging/taxonomy be used to categorize questions. Thoughts on this?

Anonymous’s picture

This issue is quite fundamental to how the whole quiz system works and could be quite complex,. So it may need definition of "How Much" control

I am only considering Multi Choice, so other types of questions may impact the concepts,

These are some of my thoughts to help promote discussion on the matter

Lets assume at least 2 Roles exist
Question Creator
Quiz Creator
There may also be need for a Quiz Manager to oversee ( though not sure)

A Quiz Creator may assign questions and probably create questions, but not necessarily
A Question Creator can create questions but not necessarily assign them

If a question is assigned to a Quiz, what should happen if a Question Creator decides to change the Question or answers.
A - Not Permitted
B - Requires Any Quiz Creator who has used the Question to Approve
C - Do what they like

As per this issue there appears to be a need for "Group" control of question selection, which may mean 1 Group or Unlimited

So how are the groups to be defined ?
A - Somehow use "Role" permissions SEE NOTE 1 BELOW
B - Use some form of Taxonomy Control SEE NOTE 2 BELOW
C - Some other method of control ( No experience of organic Groups but assume this may be a method/requirement)

NOTE 1 -
Use of Permissions by Role to define who gets what, but as there may be many different requirements it should not be added to the permissions page but an independed page ( there are already known issues with memory on some servers for permissions due to the number of variables that can be loaded)

NOTE 2 -
Using Multiple Taxonomy Vocabulary, so if a Quiz creator can access a Vocabulary they can see the questions for that vocabulary, maybe having a "Quiz Manager" assigning which vocabularies are available to which role ( IIRC there may be a module like this?) Maybe an assignment system like that which is used for input formats

Additionally
Having "Group" control of question selection, then begs the question, is the same needed for Question Creation

There is also the issue related to the number of questions available. Too many questions displayed can slow the Quiz Questions page considerably

There are currently basically 2 options to assigning Questions to a Quiz.
Direct Selection
Random based on Taxonomy

Maybe this should become

Random based on Taxonomy SEE NOTE 3
But Direct Selection becomes - Direct Selection based on Taxonomy

NOTE -3
We already have the option of assigning multiple Vocabularies to the Quiz, which allows for filtering using views, we can also assign multiple vocabularies to Multi Choice questions. But when it comes to Managing the Questions for Randomisation, they are all lumped into one List of Terms from which you can select just One. Making all Vocabularies that are available for Multichoice questions avaialbe at the selection stage would provide better control.

With only this informtaion present on this page. If Random is selected then there is no need to see the questions. However if Direct Selection is chosen you are then taken to a new page where you are presented with questions based on Each Vocabulary ANDed together and the Categories ORed together - See NOTE 3 above( this is just initial thought)

It may even be appropriate to say that the taxonomy defined for the quiz could be used to defiine what questions are presented, as the quiz questions should always be a subset of any categorisation of the Quiz.

This should bring down the number of questions presented considerably, but there will still be a problem as the number of questions grow, so maybe only 25, 50 100 questions on a page ( configurable by the QUIZ MANAGER or creator. The user selects the questions they want, then on moving to next page those questions are added to the quiz before they make their next selections. Each page is provided with a DONE button that will then take you back to the initial selection page so you can see what has been assigned either permanent or random (like existing) once the Quiz Creator is happy he then Submits

By combining the "Roles" issue, and this the number of questions presented should be quite controllable

These are just initial thoughts and I suspect i will have thousands of thoughts immediately after posting, but at least it may help start the ball rolling

Anonymous’s picture

On top of what i wrote above if still forgot to add the example of

Quiz Creator Group 1 can see Questions for Group 1 But what if he is a Quiz Taker of Group 2, he has to see the questions for Group 2, though he may not create or edit them. There could be a mess of crossover here

RichardMarcin’s picture

Hi,

What I find strange in this module is that "question creating" and "quiz creating" are two separate activities and I guess this is the fundamental problem here, if you don't mind me calling it a problem, just for this discussion.

This is how I'd like the module to work:
1. User creates a quiz and adds his own questions.
2. He can go back and edit it, add or remove questions for as long as necessary. (Link to own quizzes should be somewhere under "My account".)
3. When the quiz is finished, it gets to be published. Publishing means that it can't be edited anymore, it can be deleted though and it shows up somewhere in a list of available quizzes available for other users to take.
4. Optional: with proper permissions a user might be able to import a question from existing tests. (But honestly, how often does this happen? How often do you repeat questions? And you think users will be happy if someone else steals their questions and uses them in their own quiz?)

What I'm trying to say here is that
a. "Quiz" should be the fundamental element here, not "Quiz" and "Questions".
b. Users should be owners of their quizzes and should be able to administer them.
c. UI needs to be tweaked to make it user friendly.

I don't know if that helps in any way.
Richard

http://vetoodle.com

Anonymous’s picture

Part of the problem maybe your perception of how a Quiz should function

Addressing your 4th point first.

I have about 50 different Quiz on my site, and there are many that use the same questions, especially if you randomise on a taxonomy, or define 7 permanent questions from 10 with 6 random

For Example

You may have a Quiz that selects 10 questions at random on words from the dictionary

You may also have 26 other Quiz each for a letter in the alphabet in which you select 10 questions for each letter

The second set of Quiz is a subset of the first

The list goes on as to where there can be an overlap. Not only does it increase the number of available questions for a Quiz of any type, it also saves time, by not duplicating the same question if needed in more than one place.

Now to address your other points

1 User Creates Quiz and questions - this already exists based on permissions, though may need finer permissions if restrictions as to what type of quiz, or taxonomy may be used in teh quiz creation. Moderation may also be necesary, though there are modules to handle revision moderation.

2 Basically i agree, but version control, which is available in the revision of a Quiz should be used ( Though better documentation as to how it works might be advantageous)

3. So you spend an hour or two creating a quiz, and questions, you publish and then see an error, what do you do now ? we've all done it and will continue to do it no matter how methodical we are, and users depending on your audience could be considered next down the food chain and even more likely to make mistakes

b. On my site i have "Question makers" and "Quiz Masters" - Basically anyone can create a question thats easy, but a good quiz normally has a well ballanced seletion of questions , and this may also be based on the level of difficulty. In your case your looking at potentially any individul, or group of individuals creating their own personal Quiz and Questions Two different approaces to how a Quiz can work, and both totally valid so ideally need accommodating

As to your copyright "And you think users will be happy if someone else steals their questions and uses them in their own quiz?)"

You can place a requirement on users submitting questions that although they may own the copyright to the question and answer set, by using your service, they permit you or any other authorised user to re-use the Question set as they see fit. Its not often you will find a user objecting to this

RichardMarcin’s picture

Would it be possible to simply make "Questions random on this quiz" and "Questions never on this quiz" blocks invisible to regular (non-admin) users? This way users can add questions to their newly created quizzes but won't see previously created questions.

Anonymous’s picture

That may be one way of achieving part of the overal problem. So here are som more thoughts

But using this method it is probable that the user(s) creating a quiz will in all likelyhood end up creating the same question or minor variant at some point, if they create many questions. Depending on the size of the userbase, this could result in a large number of basically the same questions filling the database. On top of this unless you have used some method of preventing the questions appearing in Search results, you will potentially increase teh number of non relevant results.

An additional thought on using this approach, is , in my case I use the clone module to clone questions when I only have a minor variation, it works well and allows fast generation of large numbers of similar questions. Not being able to see an existing question may remove this option.

In addition by having visibility of previous questions, consistemncy of format is possible, which results in a more pleasing experience for the end user.

turadg’s picture

Title: Must all questions be visible for all quizmakers? » Question or taxonomy level access to quiz questions (currently all questions be visible to all quizmakers)
Version: 6.x-2.x-dev » 6.x-5.x-dev
Component: User interface » Code - Quiz module

Clarifying this feature request and marking it for the 5.x release.

djdevin’s picture

Component: Code - Quiz module » Code - Quiz core
Issue summary: View changes
Status: Active » Closed (outdated)

This issue is being closed because it was filed against a version that is no longer supported. If the issue still persists in the latest version of Quiz, please open a new issue.